By Dame Jackie
One of the top questions I get has to do with crit partners and writing groups. So I thought I’d do a mini Q&A today on the joys and perils of…drumroll, please…critique groups.
Do you have a critique partner?
Sure do. The fabulous Heather Brewer and I have been critting each other’s work for…**counts**…about three years now.
How’d you two hook up?
Heather and I were both members of Backspace, and we both posted regularly on the forums. (Yes, we’re both chatty. A match made in heaven!) We got a sense of each other’s writing style (and humor) in the year or so that we had been members, and we both knew we were each working on a novel. Along with posting regularly, we began sending PMs (private messages) to each other, talking about certain things with our WIPs (works in progress). And at one point, one of us said, “Um, would you like to read the first three chapters?” and the other said, “I thought you’d never ask! Want to read mine???” And so, we swapped. And from that moment on, we were crit partners.
So…like, it was really that easy?
Well…no. Lots of stuff led up to that leap of faith. I’d been in a number of writing groups before that point, both face to face and online, and I had a lot of experience reviewing other authors’ works. I took a boatload of creative writing workshops at college (about five of them, all for credit — booyah!) and learned the hard way about how to shut up and listen to people dissecting my work while all I could do was think murderous thoughts at them for not getting it. Heck, at one point, I’d launched my own in-person writing group, using the skills I learned from those college workshops. So I had a lot of experience getting feedback from authors, and over the years I learned what feedback worked for me and what didn’t.
So when Heather and I read and commented on each other’s work, I went into it knowing the sort of commenting and critiquing that resonated for me. Turns out, that’s the same sort of commenting and critiquing that resonates for Heather. 
Win-win!
What do you do when you crit each other’s work?
Heather and I read each other’s full manuscripts, sometimes at the perilously raw stage (known as First Draft Land), other times when the MS is more polished. And bluntly, we tell each other what we think works well, and what we think doesn’t work as well, and what we think really needs help — and we point out examples of all of these things — and then we make suggestions on how to strengthen what we perceive as possible weaknesses.
After we review the feedback, we decide what comments to act on, and what to leave. Yep — what to ignore. Just because we’re crit partners, that doesn’t mean we automatically do what our partner says. Those changes have to be ones we agree on. Example: I’m not a prophecy person in fantasy, but prophecy plays a key role in Heather’s series. When I was reviewing her first book (when the prophecy was first mentioned), my feedback included the suggestion of dropping the prophecy. Heather (wisely) didn’t act on that.
What we don’t do is line-edit each other’s manuscripts. We tackle the big-concept/development stuff: characters, plot, narrative structure, all that good stuff.
Why don’t you line edit?
Because I do that for my day job.
Actually, it’s because we’re at the stage when we trust our editors for line edits. Heather and I focus on the pre-editing stuff.
You mentioned being in writing groups. Is there a difference between being in a writing group and having a critique partner?
Oh yeah. Even when I was in writing groups, I tended to gravitate toward one or two people, whose critiques of my writing really connected for me, and whose writing, in turn, really worked for me. I just do better in a one-on-one environment. And it helps that Heather and I love each other’s work.
Acutally, that’s major. Heather and I are huge fans of each other’s writing. If that passion for the work wasn’t there, I doubt we’d be good crit partners.
Something else about writing groups: you rarely get the same feedback from everyone. So part of the fun is having to sift through all the comments (and criticism) and figure out which to take and which to ignore.
On top of that, writers have a tendency to read as if they’re writers. Yeah, blanket statement, I know. But I’ve found it to be true. I can’t tell you how many times I’ll read a book and say (to myself), “You know, I would have written this scene/dialogue/description differently.” So when you get a group of writers to read and critique your own writing, there’s a good chance a number of those suggestions will actually be those reviewers wanting you to rewrite your stuff in their own image. This isn’t malicious. It’s just the nature of the beast. (And it’s also why writers so desperately need good editors: people to look past the obvious brilliance and get to the nuts and bolts of making that brilliance shine.)
Does a writer need a critique partner or a writing group?
Need? Probably not. But if you’re like me, then having a crit partner is essential.
If you’re a writer, do you have a crit partner or a writing group? Do you have any questions about crit partners or writing groups? Go on — post away!
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Tags: critique group, Jackie Kessler, writing
Yeah. I can tell I’m procrastinating since I’m the first to comment. I’m trying to get my just-finished novella through a first edit so I can toss it off to my brand-spanking new CP.
I wrote singurlarly for more years than I care to admit (Ah, vanity, thy name is Silver
) Friends and family acted as sounding boards but being friends and family, everything I wrote obviously belonged on the NYT list. (I wish!) After hearing the pros and cons of a CP, I tried it. It worked well for awhile. She and I were on the same wave-length but then her life got bumpy, she stopped writing, and our CP sessions (done on-line in chat) devolved into frustration. She wanted to visit. I wanted to work. But I missed having that sounding board and backstop. So I started looking again and just tumbled into a new CP at my local RWA chapter meeting. It’s a new-to-us relationship so I can’t really say how it’s working but I like the way she thinks and her sense of humor is as warped as mine so we should do well together.
Questions? I would have had them if I hadn’t found my new BCP–mainly a plaintive whine of “Wouldn’t someone like to be my CP?” Luckily, I don’t have to ask now.
I’ve tried the writing groups and it didn’t work out. There are 3-5 people I trust as my CPs. Two are writers with decades of experience and they will not hesitate to tell me, “This sucks,” or “This is great!” (They’re very thorough in their critiques and even if we disagree, there’s still that mutual respect.) My other CPs function like an audience – does my work keep their attention, can they follow the story, etc. Not that they don’t point out possible fixes (like shorter chapters).
I’m a writer and I have three CP’s.
Wow that kind of sounds like an AA statement. “Hi, my name is Julie, and I’m an addict, ehhem, writer.”
I am also active on Kelley Armstrong’s online writing group, which has been very helpful but I wouldn’t call that my main source of feedback.
I have an online writing group and a critique partner who I found there. I use the group for wider views, general feedback, and line editing. I use my critique partner to bounce ideas around while I’m writing raw drafts or editing. I can run to her over little things and hash out small problems, and then use the critique group to beta-read and tell me what works and what doesn’t.
A friend of mine is my only critique partner and she has been for all of my short stories so far (I’ve yet to hand over any part of The Novel.) Technically, she’s more like my editor, as she doesn’t write anything herself. She has this amazing ability to dissect my work and offer up suggestions to make it better, more rounded, a full story.
In short, my work wouldn’t be even half as good without her!
Dame Rinda and I are CPs, and I found this post interesting because Dame Jackie and her CP work so differently from how Rinda and I work. We don’t critique first drafts, and we do line edit. At least, most of the time.
Why?
Well, I can’t help it. I can’t see a grammatical error, typo, or comma splice without pointing it out, because I feel like I’m not giving her my best if I don’t mention it. Also, I’m a little obsessed.
And I honestly don’t think I could work with someone who wasn’t able to critique honestly, and understand that I’m doing the same. That’s why Rinda and I are perfect for each other.
I think a little obsession can be a good thing. And that’s not just for music or cologne any more!
When you find the right crit partner — it just works.
I found a CP through Critters. She was the only one who read my first three chapters and wanted to read the whole thing. I got it back and it was like “YES! You are fantastic and picked out things that I never would have noticed!” So now we email each other regularly and I’m waiting for her to finish her edits so I can get my hands on her stuff as well.
We critique like Dame Rachel and Dame Rinda – doing second/third draft line edits.
I absolutely could not do without my CP. She is so far beyond awesome. I feel so strongly about the importance of crit partners that I actually started Crit Partner Match over at Ning (www.critpartnermatch.ning.com), which is a very low tech way to match folks up with other people looking for crit partners. It’s not enormous or anything, but there are well over 100 members and slowly growing. I think we’ve wound up with some matches and also some groups.
I have a critique partner and a couple of beta readers. They have done me so much good.
MY CP and I usually don’t send each other rough drafts, although we have (of a chapter or two) just to get input on an idea or execution. We read each other synopses, full manuscripts, and we also do line edits. And some cheerleading.
At the moment I have a friend who’s a bookseller like myself who reads through my stories but she’s gotten so busy she hasn’t really got the time.
I met another lovely lady who’s also a writer who currently has the first few chapters of my book (and I’m chewing my nails off because I’m just so nervous somebody’s reading it). I’ve read her first few pages and gave feedback and I’m really hoping that we will work out.
And I’ll go check out that site as well..
I’ve never actually had an official CP. A cousin of mine that I love dearly writes as well and we critique each other’s work. But I always have to ask myself, does she love it just because she’s family? And even if she really does love it, is there something that’s being held back for fear of hurting my feelings? So at the moment, I guess I’m searching for a CP. I think I work best on a one-on-one basis as opposed to a group. Okay, this is starting to sound like a personal ad so I think I’ll stop now, but I’d love any input on where to search to find a good CP!
I am loving having a critique group. Having that group is definitely different from just having one-on-one critiques, which for me is a good thing. Both have a purpose — and both motivate me differently as I work. That motivation aspect is almost as important to me as any of the critiques I get. One of my biggest struggles with writing isn’t the act of writing, but the sort of solitary atmosphere in which the writing takes place. Knowing that there are people on the outside of that sphere who are waiting to see what happens next is a huge help.